[VAG] VW Dieselgate: truffa nei test delle emissioni

[ricky1750]

Vuol dire sfiga

☏ D5803 ☏

[Bosco]

Ragazzi posso aggiungere anche io qualcosa di utile alla discussione?        Da me sta piovendo

[LiF]

7 ore fa, TonyH dice:

Ma è assodato che questo fantomatico "thermal Window" entri in funzione SEMPRE?

O si basano sul risultato di una singola prova, magari in condizioni di raffreddamento non ottimali?

 

Sto facendo uno sforzo notevole per cercare di chiarirmi le idee in questa faccenda ma quanto riportato nei vari siti non mi è di grande aiuto.

 

Io avevo capito che il "thermal window" (che dovrebbe riferirsi alla temperatura ambientale e non a quella del motore) non fosse in discussione, ovvero che fosse risultato dalle varie prove (tra le quali quelle della KBA) che è largamente sfruttato dalla maggior parte dei costruttori (e mi pare anche da Fiat) e che non fosse attualmente legalmente contestabile.

 

Al contrario, mi sono fatto l'idea che KBA abbia richiesto incontro per chiarimenti alle case costruttrici in presenza del sospetto dell'uso di dispositivi di carattere diverso rispetto al "Thermal window", come per es. per Opel e FCA 

 

Non ho ancora capito se il "thermal window" riguarda solo il trattamento degli NOx o in generale anche gli altri dispositivi, non ho capito se c'è anche qualche altro passaggio ambiguo ed interpretabile tra le righe delle norme che regolano l'omologazione dei veicoli secondo i criteri euro 5-6 (per es. legato alla temperatura del motore).

 

 

[jeby]

7 ore fa, owluca dice:

http://www.ilsole24ore.com/art/finanza-e-mercati/2016-09-09/vw-primo-patteggiamento-dieselgate-174429.shtml?uuid=AD22tmHB

 

Dieselgate, ingegnere Volkswagen si dichiara colpevole

 di cospirazione alla faccia di quelli  che trecento pagine fà  negavano  questa definizione di  reato.

 

 

alla facciazza!!! Però solo per gli USA, l'EU miagola nel buio

[TonyH]

10 ore fa, dennisjocks90 dice:

Io non capisco...dopo anni di onorato lavoro vogliono infangarsi così buttando tutto alle ortiche

Ma cribbio diventano vecchi per truffare.. mah

 

 

 

[loric]

9 ore fa, LiF dice:

 

Sto facendo uno sforzo notevole per cercare di chiarirmi le idee in questa faccenda ma quanto riportato nei vari siti non mi è di grande aiuto.

 

Io avevo capito che il "thermal window" (che dovrebbe riferirsi alla temperatura ambientale e non a quella del motore) non fosse in discussione, ovvero che fosse risultato dalle varie prove (tra le quali quelle della KBA) che è largamente sfruttato dalla maggior parte dei costruttori (e mi pare anche da Fiat) e che non fosse attualmente legalmente contestabile.

 

Al contrario, mi sono fatto l'idea che KBA abbia richiesto incontro per chiarimenti alle case costruttrici in presenza del sospetto dell'uso di dispositivi di carattere diverso rispetto al "Thermal window", come per es. per Opel e FCA 

 

Non ho ancora capito se il "thermal window" riguarda solo il trattamento degli NOx o in generale anche gli altri dispositivi, non ho capito se c'è anche qualche altro passaggio ambiguo ed interpretabile tra le righe delle norme che regolano l'omologazione dei veicoli secondo i criteri euro 5-6 (per es. legato alla temperatura del motore).

 

 

 

Da quello che ho capito io, anche per la 500X si parlerebbe di NOx. Preciso una cosa: "thermal window" non è un dispositivo, indica il range o i range di temperatura in base al quale / ai quali i dispositivi anti-inquinamento regolano la loro modalità di funzionamento.

 

Poiché le direttive in merito alla thermal window sono vaghe, i costruttori usano tale parametro in maniera molto lasca. Lo scopo dell'elasticità consentita dalle norme, infatti, è quello di permettere ai produttori di disattivare o ridurre il funzionamento dei dispositivi anti-emissioni, ciò in circostanze in cui tali dispositivi, se pienamente attivi, potrebbero compromettere l'integrità o la durata del motore. Diversi studi, invece, sembrerebbero indicare che i dispositivi anti-inquinamento delle auto diesel di gran parte dei produttori verrebbero spenti (o attenuati) in condizioni termiche assolutamente sicure per il motore.

 

Questo è quanto sono riuscito a ricavare dai diversi articoli e report che ho recuperato.

 

Edited:

In merito alle indagini USA sul dieselgate, leggete questo passo del report ufficiale.

 

 

 

 

 

Modificato 10 Settembre 2016 da loric

[Wilhem275]

Che spettacolo Citando @stev66, questi sono davvero andati alla Scuola del Crimine di Virgil Starkwell

[pennellotref]

http://www.autonews.com/article/20160909/OEM11/160909826/vw-engineer-pleads-guilty-in-u-s-court-to-role-in-emissions-cheating

 

Cita

VW engineer pleads guilty in U.S. court to role in emissions cheating scandal

 

 

September 9, 2016 @ 11:00 am

Ryan Beene

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James Robert Liang pleaded guilty in Detroit to one count of conspiracy to defraud the United States, commit wire fraud and violate the Clean Air Act. Photo credit: ClickOnDetroit.com

 

UPDATED: 9/9/16 4:49 pm ET - adds details from VW emails

WASHINGTON -- A Volkswagen engineer pleaded guilty today in a U.S. court for his role in rigging emissions software on 2.0-liter diesels sold in the U.S., marking the first criminal charge in the U.S. government’s probe into the VW scandal.

The engineer, James Robert Liang, was named in a grand jury indictment filed in U.S. District Court in Detroit in June that was unsealed today.

Liang pleaded guilty to one count of conspiracy to defraud the United States, commit wire fraud and violate the Clean Air Act. The Justice Department said in a statement that Liang has agreed to cooperate with the government in its ongoing VW investigation as part of his plea agreement. This could increase pressure on higher-ranking officials of the German automaker.

In a statement and court documents released today, the Justice Department provided the most detailed narrative to date about the origins of VW’s diesel emissions violations, including excerpts of revealing emails sent among VW engineers amid scrutiny from regulators before the diesel cheating became public last fall.

Liang “is coming here to Detroit today to accept responsibility for his actions,” his lawyer, Daniel Nixon, told Bloomberg. "He is remorseful." 

VW declined to comment on Liang’s indictment and said the company continues to cooperate with the Justice Department. 

"I know VW did not disclose the defeat device to U.S. regulators in order to sell the cars in the U.S.,” Liang told the judge in court. “That’s what makes me guilty.”

The information Liang is providing to prosecutors could speed the investigation of the company. Settlement talks in the criminal matter could be resolved by the end of the year, two people familiar with the probe, told Bloomberg. Germany and South Korea are conducting separate criminal probes of the company.

Scandal details

From the fall of 2006 through September 2015, “Liang and his co-conspirators, including current and former employees, and others, agreed to defraud the U.S. and VW customers, and violate the Clean Air Act, by misleading the U.S. and VW customers about whether VW diesel motors complied with U.S. emissions standards,” prosecutors said in the indictment.

According to the documents, Liang was on the team that developed the EA 189 2.0-liter diesel at the center of VW’s emissions scandal. Liang, a VW employee since 1983, began working on the EA189 engine in 2006 while at Volkswagen’s diesel engine development department at the automaker’s headquarters in Wolfsburg, Germany.

Liang and “co-conspirators” working on the engine soon realized it would not meet stricter U.S. limits on nitrogen oxide emissions that took effect in 2007 while also attracting “sufficient customer demand,” Liang’s indictment said.

In turn, Liang and his co-conspirators developed and installed the “defeat device” software to cheat on U.S. emissions tests, the indictment said. The software recognizes when a vehicle is undergoing lab testing and limits nitrogen oxide emissions to artificially-low levels in order comply with U.S. standards.

The software would eventually be used on all of the nearly 500,000 2.0-liter diesel engines sold by VW in the U.S. market from 2009-2015, the Justice Department said.

Liang moved to the United States in 2008 to help launch the new “clean diesel” engine in the U.S. market and was VW’s “Leader of Diesel Compliance” while working at the company’s testing facility in Oxnard, Calif., west of Los Angeles, prosecutors said.

Liang admitted to attending meetings between personnel from VW AG and its U.S. operation and officials from the EPA and California’s Air Resources Board for certifications from the regulators to sell the diesels in the U.S. market, the Justice Department said.

In those meetings, VW personnel hid the existence of the defeat device software and claimed that the diesels complied with U.S. emissions standards, the government said in its statement.

In one such meeting, Liang and other VW personnel met March 19, 2007, with EPA officials in Ann Arbor, Mich., where the agency has its emissions testing lab. Liang and others from VW described software functions of the EA 189 engine that affected emissions controls but concealed the existence of the cheat software from the EPA, according to the indictment.

Liang and VW personnel also concealed the cheat software from CARB in a meeting just days later in El Monte, Calif., the indictment said.

False compliance

VW continued to “falsely and fraudulently certify to EPA and CARB” that VW’s diesel vehicles complied with U.S. emissions standards and the Clean Air Act, the Justice Department said.

Liange also admitted that he and others at VW falsely marketed the 2.0-liter diesel engines as “clean diesel” and environmentally-friendly, the government said.

As part of his guilty plea, Liang admitted to helping “his co-conspirators continue to lie to the EPA, CARB and VW customers even after the regulatory agencies started raising questions,” the Justice Department said.

As vehicles equipped with the cheat software aged, they saw elevated rates of warranty claims related to the emissions control, according to the indictment.

In 2014, Liang and others involved issued a software update for the diesels that claimed to be “intended to improve the vehicle,” according to the indictment.

In fact, the update altered the cheat software to use the angle of the steering wheel to more easily detect when it was undergoing official testing, “thereby improving the defeat device’s precision” as a way to reduce stress on the emissions control systems, according to the indictment.

VW managed to conceal on-road NOx emissions that were far above permissible levels in its diesels until March 2014, when West Virginia University published a study showing NOx emissions of three VW diesels significantly exceeded U.S. standards. 

The findings prompted CARB and EPA officials to probe the cause of the excess emissions and press VW for answers. Liang and others attempted to blame the excess emissions on “innocent mechanical and technological problems” while “secretly knowing” that the cheat software was the culprit, according to the indictment.

The indictment also contains excerpt from emails between Liang and other VW employees exchanged as scrutiny from regulators increased in 2015 before the EPA announced VW’s malfeasance in September.

In April 2015, after a recall to update the diesel vehicle’s emissions software failed to fully address the excess emissions, Liang was copied on an email sent by another VW employee who said, in German, "we ‘only need a plausible explanation’ as to why the emissions are still high!!!"

According to the indictment, Liang was copied on another email in June 2015 with the subject line “[C]ARB Status” in which a VW employee wrote, also in German, “We must be sure to prevent the authority from testing the Gen1,” referring to the EA 189 diesel engine. The email continued "If the Gen 1 goes onto the roller at the CARB, then we’ll have nothing more to laugh about!!!!!"

Il secondo articolo è ancora meglio e spiega più dettagliatamente un aspetto solo sommariamente richiamato nel precedente:

 

http://jalopnik.com/vw-made-its-defeat-device-more-potent-to-save-on-warran-1786442999

Cita

VW Made Its Defeat Device More Potent To Save On Warranty Repairs: Court Docs

David Tracy

Yesterday 2:59pm

Filed to: DIESELGATE

11.9K

879

 

Photo: Brennan Linsley

In the court documents charging Volkswagen engineer James Robert Liang with fraud for developing VW’s diesel emission cheat, exists a small section about a software update in 2014. It alleges VW made its cars even more harmful to the environment just so the company could save on warranty costs.

The plea agreement claims Liang and “co-conspirators” made the defeat device more “effective” because emissions control components started failing and costing the company money. The plea agreement reads:

As VW’s “clean diesel” vehicles in the United States began to age, they experienced higher rates of warranty claims for parts and components related to emissions control systems. Some of LIANG’s coconspirators believed that the increased claims were a result of the vehicle operating in testing mode too long rather than switching to “road mode.”

It goes on:

 

Because of these increased claims, LIANG worked with his co-conspirators to enhance the defeat device to allow the vehicle to more easily recognize when the vehicle was no longer in testing mode.

And the indictment alleges how Liang and others adjusted the software:

Liang and his co-conspirators falsely and fraudulently told, and caused others to tell, U.S. customers and other that a software update in about 2014 was intended to improve the vehicles when, in fact, LIANG and his conspirators knew that the update used the steering wheel angle of the vehicle as a basis to more easily detect when the vehicle was undergoing emissions tests, thereby improving the defeat device’s precision in order to reduce the stress on the emissions control systems.

That’s absurd. According to these court documents, engineers at VW had the audacity to issue a software update to customers that dialed down emissions control usage and spewed more NOx into the environment, just so the company could save a buck.

This also essentially confirms the answer to the question we so often hear – “Why doesn’t Volkswagen just keep ‘testing mode’ on all the time?” Apparently doing so would cause the cars to fall apart.

 

Modificato 10 Settembre 2016 da pennellotref

[Pawel72]

12 ore fa, dennisjocks90 dice:

Io non capisco...dopo anni di onorato lavoro vogliono infangarsi così buttando tutto alle ortiche

Ma cribbio diventano vecchi per truffare.. mah

 

Mah..... gli inizi del brand VW voluto fortemente da Adolf Hitler..... lo dico in modo molto diplomatico sono piuttosto poco onesti...

 

Quando Hitler vide le automobili Tatra...rimane affascinato...si presume quindi che la Porche avrebbe utilizzato ( rubato) i disegni e progetti della casa automobilistica cecoslovacca..per costruire la VW Beetle  
Nel 1967 comunque la Tatra viene risarcita dalla Volkswagen pagando 3.000.000 deutche mark...  
Tatra uno degli aspetti più affascinanti e meno noti di questa Marca, è che proprio la Casa cecoslovacca avrebbe influito sulla realizzazione del famosissimo VW "Maggiolino"! Nella prima foto in alto, difatti, possiamo notare la Tatra "T97" del 1936, equipaggiata con un 4 cilindri boxer posteriore raffreddato ad aria...vi ricorda qualcosa?

http://wizbangpop.com/2009/11/01/great-car-wars-the-tatra-t97-vs-volkswagen.php

 

Per quanto riguarda il Dieselgate.. ecco un articolo interessante apparso su Le Monde..

Dieselgate : Bruxelles hausse le ton face à Volkswagen

Bruxelles estime diposer d’un début de « base juridique » contre VW.

 

La commissaire à la justice, Vera Jourova, a estimé que la Commission « ne peut faire comme si rien ne s’était passé » et brandi la menace de « class actions » (recours en justice collectifs) en Europe. Elle a expliqué son intention de rencontrer, à ce sujet, les autorités nationales de protection des consommateurs le 8 septembre, ainsi que des représentants des autorités nationales et les dirigeants de VW, le 29.

Ce n’est pas la première fois que Bruxelles prend la défense des consommateurs européens contre VW, mais, jusqu’à présent, l’institution s’était contentée de réclamer des indemnisations « volontaires » de la part de VW. La commissaire à l’industrie, Elzbieta Bienkowska, a rencontré régulièrement la direction du géant allemand depuis fin 2015, en vain.

De la difficulté d’une class action

Du coup, la colère monte en Europe, d’autant qu’aux Etats-Unis VW a accepté de verser 15 milliards de dollars (13,45 milliards d’euros) pour tenter de régler les litiges, ainsi qu’à racheter ou réparer 480 000 voitures. Les propriétaires pourraient être indemnisés (10 000 dollars au maximum). En juillet, les avocats généraux de trois Etats (New York, le Maryland et le Massachusetts) ont annoncé des actions judiciaires, estimant que la fraude remontait à 1999 et impliquait les dirigeants de VW.

 

 

http://www.lemonde.fr/economie/article/2016/09/06/dieselgate-bruxelles-hausse-le-ton-face-a-volkswagen_4993377_3234.html

[Wilhem275]

I nazisti magari lasciamoli fuori, che se dobbiamo aprire 80 anni di armadi ne vengono fuori scheletri interessanti per qualsiasi azienda.

Modificato 10 Settembre 2016 da Wilhem275