3 minuti fa, aargh! scrive:

? Torniamo In Topic.

A government, Unions,  managers and private investors, what could go wrong?

 

Here on CNBC is explained quite clearly the mess the French government was doing trying to involve the Japanese government (!) to get an agreement on the FCA+R deal by Nissan's.

 

Immagino le risate a Palazzo Imperiale.... :)

P.S. per fare fare ai giapponesi qualcosa che non vogliono ci vuole ( letteralmente ) la bomba atomica,  figuriamoci come hanno accolto il marito di Brigitte..    :)

 

FCA-Renault merger is not yet a write-off

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The blame game over the breakdown of Fiat Chrysler Automobiles and Renault's 35 billion-euro ($39 billion) merger will soon pass. The enduring question is whether the two automakers have better options than combining with each other. Returning to the table still looks like the least painful way forward.

 

FCA walked, citing French politics. Its 50:50 merger proposal was clearly not far from being an acceptable deal. The terms offered a financial premium and pledges to safeguard jobs, while identifying savings for Nissan, Renault's existing partner. FCA has to protect its own shareholders -- its withdrawal reminds the world they matter, too -- but the automaker was wise to leave the door slightly ajar.

 

Neither FCA nor Renault have a plan B that looks quite as attractive industrially. For the former, the alternative European move looks to be a merger with PSA Group. Crunch the two together at today's market values and PSA's shareholders would own 51 percent of the combination, giving them a smidgen more of the value creation and the impression of getting the better side of the deal. Paris might feel that is an easier transaction to sell to the French public. especially as FCA's average market value over the last six months has been slightly higher than PSA's.

 

Yet it's hard to believe that PSA would be a better cultural fit than Renault. That is a paramount consideration for a complex merger integration. FCA's talks with Renault evolved speedily from an initial discussion about an industrial partnership. Even if you didn't believe the companies would ever fully achieve the 5 billion euros of annual synergies FCA identified, the benefits would be still be considerable. What's more, Renault's alliance with Nissan means the scope for savings could be well beyond what might be possible with PSA.

 

For Renault, a transaction with FCA remains the most credible near-term way of narrowing the discount to its theoretical value. If you subtract the value of the French automaker's stake in Nissan, its cash and other investments, shareholders put no value whatsoever on its actual business of making vehicles.

 

True, Renault has the possibility of expanding industrial ties, and possibly merging, with Nissan. But it cannot ignore the market reaction to the FCA proposal. Shares of Renault, FCA and PSA are all up slightly from where they were before talks leaked 12 days ago, baking in some lingering hope of consolidation. Renault stock, however, is up the most. That might be the market waking up to its undervaluation. More likely, it's a recognition of what the company stands to gain if consolidation remains possible.

 

Choreographing a comeback will not be easy. This is a battle to be the master of Renault while making a transaction look like a merger of equals. Any final agreement would probably have to look like it was brokered by Paris. What will matter for investors is whether continued government interference prevents decisions from being made on a commercial basis.

 

Under FCA's first proposal, the two companies would nominate four directors each. The French state would be excluded from the boardroom and see its voting rights fall from just under 30 percent to 7.5 percent, in line with its economic stake in the combined company. Giving it one of the four board seats, while still diluting its voting power, could be a tolerable a compromise to get a deal done. France's influence would still be reduced relative to today, which might just persuade Italy against trying to acquire a stake and a matching seat.

After all, France and Italy are going to make life difficult for these companies either way -- whether they are in the board room or not. Leave it to the market to punish the stock accordingly.

 

 

https://europe.autonews.com/automakers/fca-renault-merger-not-yet-write

2 minuti fa, stev66 scrive:

 

 

Molto semplicemente, basta far parlare i numeri

Alfa romeo Montreal vendute ( 1970 - 1977 ) 3.925 .

Per capirci :

Ferrari Dino 246 GT ( 1969 -1973 ) ( con motore Fiat in ghisa )   3.761

Ferrari Dino 208/308 GT ( 1973 -1980 ) 820 + 2826

 

Alfa Romeo poteva a fine '70 diventare la ferrari Bis oppure un costruttore mainstream premium.

Visti i numeri, direi scelta obbligata .

 

 

 

 

 

ma alfa romeo E' la ferrari bis!! nell'immaginario degli stranieri che capiscono di auto alfa romeo é una ferrari con cilindrata minore!

 

la cosa incredibile é che in ialia nessuno sembra accorgersi di questa semplice verità, tutti qui sopra si chiedono ma come vende la volvo rispetto alla giulia? come vende classe c rispetto alla giulia? come vende citroen rispetto alla giulia? come vende la tata nano rispetto alla giulia?

 

gli italiani sembrano dare per scontato che alfa romeo sia una geeralista al max una generalista se le cose vanno benissimo premium come le tedesche

 

ma all'estero i veri conoscitori d'auto non capscono perché alfa debba essere generalsta o premium-tedesco

 

io trovo incredibile questa differenza tra l'idea che hanno gli italiani del marchio alfa e l'idea che ne hanno i conoscitori d'auto nei paesi dove si collezionano auto

 

e lo stesso per maserati, all'estero maserati é la ferrari con quattro porte, epore qui sopra si legge quanto vende a tata nano rispetto a maserati?

 

il fatto é che pure il management ha questa impostazione all'italiana, alfa e maserati non funzioneranno mai come smil-premium tedesche perché non é questa la loro mission storica

Torniamo IT per favore???

1 ora fa, Bare scrive:

According to NY Times commanding approval from Nissan was just French Government's diversion to got a separate deal with French Unions. After making an deal with FCA, the French Government and French Unions made a separate deal to seek "Favorite Nation Status" out FCA with Poland,Italy, and the United States as the "alternative nations" where FCA would have to cut jobs first before touching any "French Job".

 

Roba da brividi, ho finito la carta igienica e ho ancora stimolo ...... Come dice il detto "qui va en Renault va en velo" .... senza sella però.

 

Uno piu grande di te ti pone un 50:50 ma da ragazzina viziata alzi l'asticella, lo credo bene che Nissan sta perdendo le staffe ....

Modificato 7 Giugno 20196 anni fa da Bosco

Bentivogli, FCA, Renault: il nazionalismo francese e l’assenza del Governo Italiano hanno fatto saltare tutto

 

Quote

 

Il confronto tra FCA e Renault per una possibile fusione che avrebbe dato luogo al terzo gruppo al mondo di automotive, era già partito in modo squilibrato. La colpevole quanto ingiustificata e totale assenza del governo italiano, ha disallineato il confronto tra i due gruppi. Da una parte con Renault che aveva dalla sua, oltre alla partecipazione dello Stato al 15% il governo impegnato in prima linea con il primo ministro Macron e il Ministro delle Finanze Le Maire, per l’l’Italia solo l’azionista privato senza il minimo interesse, né dichiarazioni di interesse alla partita da parte del Ministro dello Sviluppo Economico né tantomeno del premier Conte. Questo ha creato le condizioni per un confronto del tutto proteso per parte francese. Una vicenda che ha dell’incredibile, è pazzesco che Palazzo Chigi non abbia minimamente accarezzato l’idea di partecipare al confronto per un’operazione industriale così delicata quanto importante sul piano industriale che economico, a livello nazionale e globale per gli impatti che avrebbe avuto sull’intero settore e sulla prospettiva.

Come Fim Cisl abbiamo in questi giorni più volte sollecitato un intervento del governo italiano, ma senza nessuna risposta. Parigi ha cominciato a strafare, a dettare la linea su svalutazione azionaria di Fca, posti di lavoro, volumi di produzione e management, con tanto di Presidente e amministratore delegato. Ieri sera eravamo al pre-accordo mentre il governo italiano non se ne è neanche accorto. Il nazionalismo francese da una parte e l’assenza del Governo Italiano hanno fatto saltare tutto spingendo gli azionisti di Fca a ritirare l’offerta.

Le nozze tra i due gruppi si possono ancora salvare, non credo sia tutto finito, anche se non è facile recuperare. Questa operazione serviva alla nostra industria e a quella francese, con la quale abbiamo in essere molti accordi, perché in qualunque modo la si voglia vedere i consolidamenti in questo settore in questi anni ci saranno. Se non sarà Fca per Renault sarà un altro, ma sarà fondamentale per la tenuta e la competitività del settore nel nostro paese.

Il punto è che anche su eventuali altre partite il governo deve avere un ruolo, come d’altra parte avviene nel resto del mondo. In Italia invece su lavoro e industria c’è un disinteresse generale ad oggi livello politico, così rischiamo di rimanere dei moscerini in mezzo a tanti più grossi di noi. Non penso che sia tutto finito. Lo stop dell’intesa e la reazione della Borsa forse aiuterà ma servirà che Parigi metta da parte il suo nazionalismo, solo allora la trattativa può riprendere. Ma non senza la presenza di un interlocutore politico italiano.

Roma, 6 giugno 2019

Ufficio Stampa Fim Cisl

 

 

https://www.fim-cisl.it/2019/06/06/fca-renault-il-nazionalismo-francese-e-lassenza-del-governo-italiano-hanno-fatto-saltare-tutto/

 

devono parlare direttamente con nissan, meglio dopo aver fatto uscire la nuova 500 e le nuove maserati

1 minuto fa, shadow_line scrive:

devono parlare direttamente con nissan, meglio dopo aver fatto uscire la nuova 500 e le nuove maserati

 

Ho sentito che senza Giulia Sw non se ne fa nulla.

non mi pare che sia stato postato questo che sembra essere un altro punto di vista sulla vicenda e su come sono andate le cose

LONDON (Reuters) - The collapse of merger talks between Fiat Chrysler Automobiles(FCA) and Renault marks a setback for a tight network of current and former Goldman Sachs’ bankers who tried to convince the French political establishment to back the deal.

Goldman Sachs had elbowed out FCA’s house bank UBS, which was close to FCA’s late Chief Executive Sergio Marchionne, to lead on the deal for the Italian-U.S. carmaker.

Helping Renault was New York-based Ardea Partners, a boutique advisory firm launched in 2016 by Chris Cole who had spent 30 years at Goldman Sachs including co-chairing the investment banking business.

“This deal was cooked up among friends who have known each other for years,” said a source involved in the talks. “But despite their relationship and banking experience, it all fell apart.”

Cole was directly involved in the negotiations on behalf of Renault and had Goldman’s chairman of investment banking, FX de Mallmann, as his counterpart representing FCA.

The pair worked closely with another former Goldman banker, Laurent Clarenbach, who spent 10 years at the Wall Street bank between 2001 and 2011 and is now a partner at French boutique bank d’Angelin & Co.

London-based d’Angelin, launched by French banker Benoit d’Angelin in 2017, was brought in by FCA to help market the 33 billion euro ($37 billion) deal to the French government given his founder’s close ties with French President Emmanuel Macron.

The French government owns 15% of Renault and was immediately seen as a major obstacle to getting a deal done.

But advisers at both sides of the negotiating table were bullish about finding an agreement.

“Their long-lasting friendship and mutual trust played a role in keeping them upbeat, even when Paris starting demanding more control over the merged entity,” one source close to the deal said.

TACTICS “BACKFIRED”

Ardea Partners and Goldman often help each other on business and share work for high profile clients. They are currently advising advertising giant WPP on its ongoing sale of data analytics unit Kantar. Ardea’s executive team mainly consists of former Goldman bankers including James Del Favero, who spent 26 years at the Wall Street bank.

The Goldman network had been expected to secure the backing of Macron’s government before the deal became public, several sources said, adding Goldman deployed staff from its New York, Paris and London offices in a bid to win France’s blessing.

But, this time, Goldman and its allies failed to deliver, amid demands for more control by the French state and resistance from Renault’s alliance partner Nissan, which decided to abstain from a Renault board vote on the deal.

“They couldn’t navigate the complexity of this deal and their plan of sidelining Nissan backfired,” the first source said.

Goldman declined to comment on this report, while Ardea Partners was not immediately available for comment.

French Finance Minister Bruno Le Maire demanded that, as one of the main conditions for talks to progress, the deal needed the backing of Nissan.

But FCA and its banks did not lay the groundwork to secure Nissan’s endorsement, having kept the Japanese carmaker in the dark about the merger plan to avoid leaks.

“It was an ill-conceived deal from the start,” said a source close to Nissan. “FCA’s advisers thought they could corner Nissan and secure France’s approval in a couple of days. They clearly minimized the risks.”

Lo spacchetta cellulari non ha ancora fatto un video in merito?