Bare

4 hours ago, AlfaZeta6 said:

Alfa Romeo Falzarego, Pordoi, Giau, Gavia, Sellaronda, Gardena

Kronplatz

Baby Jeep will be unveiled before the end of this year.

When we can expect first media drives?

Will some cars be on EMP2 v4 or on STLA-M. Those two are not one and the same.

Beautiful choice of killing eMini and going with shitty CMP. Thank You mister Le Cost Cutter!

Cherokee -> STLA Large

I would not be too optimistic. Based on what I've seen I would say that R&D will be far from Italy for mass market brands. For big cats Auburn Hills will be the leader while for FWD platforms there are ex PSA R&D centers.

4.6 m

22 minutes ago, __P said:

Mi pare ci sia in sviluppo una crossover…

@Bare hai qualche infin più?

🤐

6 -> STLA-L

14 hours ago, __P said:

Ragazzi, il T6 avrà applicazioni sui marchi americani in sostituzione dei V8 Hemi Standard. Non c’è mai stata nessuna intenzione di usarlo ne su AR ne tanto meno su Maserati.

 

Maserati ha il suo Nettuno, Alfa ha il suo V6 Quadrifoglio che avrà vita fino alla EOP di Stelvio e Giulia attuali, se non cambiano idea nel prossimo futuro.

What you are talking about is Manley's plan which was inherited by French.

Marchionne was always more grandiose and V6 90° in all of its versions was planned to be used by Alfa and Maserati which includes Nettuno. 

Not to mention that V6 90° was planned also with mid 400 HP power level.

400 HP? Ideal even for Italian brands on North American market. Or course with slightly more tech like Multiair. 

3 minutes ago, Beckervdo said:

normale. Ma lo spray arc o il trattamento dlc è replicabile solo in rettifiche specializzate. C'èda dire che nel 2022 è raro trovare un monoblocco da rettificare.

 

Io credo che in FCA hanno preso il B58 di BMW e l'hanno ricalcato di pari passo

 

https://youtu.be/UUKc3yhmCOk

On 3/22/2022 at 7:58 PM, Beckervdo said:

Same analysis Bare. With Porsche's Engine above 1000 °C too, it was already now from techical papers wich refer to continuous problems to the VGT.

850° C are however a high temperature for a turbocharger with VGT for "mass-market" use

I'll correct myself. 1.5 TSI 130 HP which operates under Miller cycle has 880°C exhaust temperature. Original version showcased at Wolfsburg had Garrett turbocharger. But here we are talking about 2016. Today it's 2022.

Today Garret has VGT capable for 1020°C exhaust temperature while for Borg Warner it's 980°C.

There is a reason why 1.5 TSI Miller has torque limited to just 200 Nm.

1.5 TSI with 150 HP is not Miller.

Tonale needs 1.5 with around 200 HP and optional Q4 ASAP.

1 hour ago, Beckervdo said:

Ah beh, media del 10% di scarto tra Tmin e Tmax tra Ciclo Miller e Ciclo Otto.

Al posto di avere 900 °C, abbiamo 810 °C

 

Sui diesel siamo tra i 650 e 700 °C, mica sono pochi 100 °C di differenza -.-

 

Aren't modern petrol engines alredy at 1050°C. For example 1.5 TSI 150 HP.

Miller 1.5 TSI could be at 850°C.

9 hours ago, __P said:

A parte i 17”, i pneumatici han tutti larghezza di 235 mm.

Exact dimensions are?

My understanding is that we will see BEV only launches starting in 2027.

Stelvio and Giulia will come in 2025 and 2026 which by my understanding means that they will not be BEV only models.

Anyway. Technically it's a suicide to do BEV only models on multienergy platforms. 

1 hour ago, 4200blu said:

No no, la phev piu potente non avra una potenza cosi esgerata ma piu come la phev della Tonale. 
 

 

326?

New BMW X1 which will debut the next month will focus on similar powertrwins as Tonale.

1.5 Inline 3 with 140 and 170 HP mated to a 7 speed Magna/Getrag hybrid DCT.

On 2/10/2022 at 3:15 PM, aboutdas said:

Con quale cambio? Il 9 rapporti che è stato bocciato da ogni rivista sulla faccia della terra? 😂

 

Senza un cambio adatto, non c'è motore che tenga. Per cui si potenzierà l'elettrico, se mai sarà

They can always opt for an 8 speed Aisin.

I don't know what have happened with the new 8 speed automatic which was under development of FCA US. The new 8 speed for FWD based cars.

GME T4 Evo or GME T4 2nd Gen is also under development. I don't know if Tonale is using it. 

3 hours ago, nucarote said:

Una pseudo Mito a 5p avrebbe dimensioni vicino a quelle di Giulietta (4.25/4.30 m). Per cui alla fine la Kid sostituirà quanto meno la parte bassa della gamma Giulietta.

 

Comunque faccio ancora presente che la Tonale è di fatto una sorta di 156 SW, per lo meno come dimensioni e con un bagagliaio decisamente più grande anche nella versione PHEV.

I still can't understand to base it on failed project called Mokka or DS3 Crossback. 2008 II size as the starting point would be much better.

But it seems that they always need to shoot themselves in the leg.

Not to mention use of very bad PSA motorisation. IMO Italian car fan wants to drive Italian car with Italian engine.

In my opinion much more sense would have 2.2 diesel with aluminium block in 2 power steps, let's say 150 and 200 HP, than this 1.6 cast iron base diesel with 130 HP.

But as it was in the past transmission is a bottleneck of Small Wide platforms. 9 speed ZF is just not good enough while even Getrag DCT is torque limited. 

When it comes to design this car is very good.

4 minutes ago, __P said:

Ma la mancanza del 4x4 meccanico è solo sul mercato europeo!

Magari se andate in conce a chiedergliela ve la importano anche qui!

 

Ah no… ha quei 6 cv in più di superbollo 🤣

256 250 HP just for Europe.

2 minutes ago, gpat said:

Praticamente sovrapponibile al 1.5 eTSI a ciclo miller.

Bel motore, niente da dire

Only 130 HP TSI is Miller, not the 150 HP one.

This project is long in the plans and will be based on Small Wide platform for South American market.